Soo PVP vs PVE – skills and gear and does any of it crossover?

Ahhh BBB your topic has indeed run off without you. To be honest I reckon PVP and PVE are like two sides of a train track that runs smack bang down the center of the WoW town and the communities on each side think that the other side is the ‘down-town’ of the game – dirty, dangerous, and undeserving of uptown privileges.

*GreenHunter wanders off humming Uptown Girl.*

I think I first tapped into the discussion while listening to the Twisted Nether podcast

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Pause for Podcast Rec: Twisting Nether is in fact a rather awesome podcast for anyone who likes to read WoW blogs (or even those who would have liked to read blogs but don’t have the time.) It’s a great podcast to start your podcast addiction on, particularly if you are a Hunter class. Twisted Nether is hosted by Bre of Gun-Loving-Dwarf-Chick (big hunter blog that one, and entertaining to-boot) and Fimlys from Asleep-at-the-WoW (alt-ahoic blog with a hunter main.)

Why is it awesome?

Well I had to research podcasts for work once, think ‘whole literature review’, quantitative and qualitative research and ‘conference presentations’ it was painful –and the truth is they do everything pretty much right. Nice mix of voices, inclusion of music and humour, targeted audience, clear recording, great gossip and interviews with people you know well from blogs (Pike! BBB! GM Chick! Yay – *insert some fan-girl squee here*.) I don’t commute where I live so I tend to play their podcast while farming primal or some other obnoxious WoW task that I am required to complete for the purposes of future game-fun. It sure beats recycled wow music :p

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Anyhows… Lets talk about the GEAR part:

I agree with BBB PVP does not really prepare one for PVE and vice-versa. It’s interesting that both sides can get gear that works on the other side of the tracks, more interesting is how judgmental people can be about someone purchasing this gear or rocking around on the ‘inappropriate’ side of the tracks in it.

As far as ownership feelings about PVP gear go -I can tell you in the beginning that as a PVPer it hurt when PVP gear became easier to get (I am pre BC – pre honour system.) If you happened to get involved in the struggle to get PVP ranks in the old system it gave you a strange exaggerated sense of the importance that PVP ranked equipment had (I believe raids worked similarly.) As a little noob I even had a little tatty copy of an ingame book that described the PVP ranks for horde (you got it from visiting the PVP vendor outside the Hall of Champions – that vendor sold the cloak and scout tabard etc and you would visit this vendor and then watch ‘warlord’ ranked glowing Tauren warriors stride past you and go into the locked hall … /sigh) and this little book was kept in the bank next to my epic war mount as I leveled up.

So PVP gear became easier to get … which was a mixed blessing – now I could gear up faster for that thing I enjoyed – PVP. But the gear no longer had Rep requirements and seeing someone decked out in the AB set (you could recognize the boots and shoulders a mile off) was no longer a reason to start a BG related conversation because you knew you both must have loved +run speed boots enough to grind bloody AB at a level where honour rewards equated to a half handful of peanuts *insert hey friend for life we be both equally insane lolz*. Queues became cross-realm and you no longer had to wait to play (in my case get up at 5am Australian time before work to be able to play at an hr where people would actually be on a US server), but this also meant that if you were a solo gamer (not a guild gamer) that you no longer developed coincidental best buddies that you would meet time & again in BGs horde side nor did you develop any awesome known nemesis (i.e. that bloody gnome again arrghhh) or even get to know of feared PVP guilds on your own server – “Dear god it’s *insert guild name here* make sure you gank em world side. They have no mercy”.

Each development had an upside to game play and a downside to familiar PVP culture as I knew it.
PVP gear gained resilience – and I was like: o_O omg PVP gear that actually helps you avoid world ganking from enemy raiders of the same level – that is absolutely brilliant!

But then you could buy this gear from the SSO badge vendors and it was better than the BG welfare epics, which meant that to have a PVP advantage I would need to get into arenas etc. Arenas are a very different type of game play to BGs.

So in my quest to achieve some form of gear mediocrity I have to say:

  • My PVP gear is not really good for instances as it has piddling hit and int – so I have to PUG for PVE gear. (As I am in a very casual friends guild – they all just hit 70 fairly recently too.)
  • BGs do not give me really good PVP gear either – that is now found in the Arenas. However Arenas seem to be harder to Pug then an instance. I guess this may be because there is only a gear reward from them – it’s a month long quest and even though the battles are short and sweet it is disheartening to only win 2-3 outa 10 matches because you are under skilled at small group PVP, have a bad group composition and no resilience. There’s a reason they introduced rep based PVP gear – and that’s because without it starting arenas these days is bloody disheartening – I came into arenas around season three because I wanted the nice axe.
  • I could get good PVP gear by collecting badges, but for that I need good PVE gear for heroic instances. This takes me back to the start of my cycle.

Ahh this is the trouble with casual gaming – I’m not hardcore enough for arenas or raiding, or even joining a dedicated PVP/PVE guild (although I think at this level that may be the only way I can keep progressing with the huge gear focus of endgame content.) Currently I’m crafting LW blues and purples between running various outland instances on normal (and I specced enchanting)… I have time & wow drive for about 1 instance a week if I am lucky (last night for example I did steam vaults with those new to 70 mates – and even though we knew this instance and started with a team of 4 it still took 2-3 hrs to organise and complete, that’s a bed time well past midnight for me with a 6am wakeup call the next day – that’s kinda unhealthy to do too often.)

So this is my opinion on the GEAR debate – I reckon the changes to make PVP gear easier to get were for the PVE community (and yes those toons new to 70) so people could actually participate in PVP aspects of the game without experiencing so much failure they get disheartened and give up. On the other side of the coin removing attunements and creating 5-10 mans etc is probably for my side of the tracks.

As a new to 70 toon without a big daddy guild I am finding that its gear holding me back more than skillz. My friends and I are not leet, but we are not idiots either. We work well as a group, we all know our classes better than the other wow classes as a matter of course because these are our mains. We have set roles, the Pally is the tank, the Tree dishes out tree juice and the Warlock & I provide DPS. We let the Pally mark stuff because he pretty much does his own thing as a matter of course and it’s easier to make him tell us with little symbols where he is about to dash off to before he engages. I pull when it’s needed (not so much with a pally tank), the warlock and I can and do provide CC (once again less than I am accustomed to providing because it’s a bloody PALLY tank – he takes 30% fun out the whole hunter mob management dance – I mean surely I learnt to kite and chain trap for a reason … bah.) The unknown element is whoever we pick up for a fifth DPS. It’s not a bad group make up despite its coincidental formation, and they learn an instance fast. However we are honestly still gearing for pre-K & heroic (really old hat & content for most bloggers) and it is all-in-all a bloody slow process.

I feel we won’t get to experience a lot of BC content before Wot-licky is out … woe.
Unless I bail for a big guild – heh but then I will need a certain level of gear to meet the common requirements.

So do I like how it is becoming easier for PVE types to get their hands on PVP gear as a PVPer? – well not really on a petty emotional level … but I can see the need and frankly a raider has as much right to PVP gear for PVP as I do for PVE gear to help me get into raiding guilds. I guess heroic instances rate a higher level of skill then crazy BGs so that is why badge PVP gear is better than simple honour brought stuff … small snivel here.

Do I like how they are making PVE instance easier to access and the development of 10 mans etc to hook people like me into PVE content … oh hell yess! – I do apologise for appearing to be the sort of scrub from the wrong side of the tracks that many Raiders fear contact with. But really there are pro PVPers out there who BOT in BGs, and there are pro Raiders who are high strung whiny prima donnas who ninja loot in PUGs. People are not their gear, and frankly I have decided to simply play the parts of wow I think are fun and simply take what loot comes my way and not disdain toons less I know they be worthy of disdain. It’s the only way I can sleep nights :p.

Do I think the PVP gear is as good as the PVE gear … well badge PVP gear is said to be equal to or better than a lot of PVE gear of that level. As a PVPer I would just like to say I can’t get my hands on it because eeerm … my PVE gear is not good enough yet – o_O yah. Apparently S4 glad gear is also rated with top raid gear (?) – eh I can’t get my hands rated S4 gear either (well I could but it would require more work than I have time for.) Apparently badge PVE gear is hot too on the gear rating level … I also can’t buy that yet either… shoot me. Dunno it’s apparently easier to get, but I can tell you it’s still kinda outa reach for some of us.

If its old school visual proof of been there done that – eh Wot-licky will probably result in the sharding of purples (gemmed enchanted purples T_T) to be replaced with nasty green clown gear … just like BC did. I did hide my street sweeper in the bank because it still has an emotional kick as an awesome horde PVP gun for me o_O.

GEAR is pretty temporary – crazy wow stories are forever ^_^.

….PVP vs PVE cont.

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About Bytes

Guild Officer, one of those elderly burnt out officer types. My current main is a Hunter (MS the under-dog talent tree Beast Master.) Together with my virtual cat I battle evil, kick butt and take names. I am interested in research and new technology RealLife side. These skills carry over into the hobby.
This entry was posted in Great Green Hunter, Hunter, Old Blog Content, PVE, PVP, Snake in the Grass, World of warcraft and tagged , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

5 Responses to Soo PVP vs PVE – skills and gear and does any of it crossover?

  1. Another aspect to consider is that some pvp gear is just not suited to pve. A set of Pally tank gear from pvp does not cut it for pve main tanking. You can mix and match a bit, but at the end of the day pve is where pallys get the goods. Warlocks, Mages, etc all seem to be able to use pvp gear in mid range pve; but thats because its about damage.

  2. Larísa says:

    I loved your last statement, that gear is temporary and crazy wow stories are forever. Probably you’ll get much more interesting stories and memories out of your 2-3hour steamvault run with some mates than I get on a totally overgeared speed-run in the same spot just to lay my hands on the daily-heroic bunch of badges, where all loot just is sharded…

    I can’t really understand this obsession with gear some players show up.

  3. Lactic Acid says:

    Oh yeah the Pally I group with complains about the tank gear too 🙂

    Ahaahaaa thankyee both & strangely enough I can deliver a crazy story

    – there I was chatting on voice the whole instance because I could see everyone in the party had their sound etc on, and wondering why they were all so quite (which didn’t stop me from chatting awkwardly.) Turns out I had some setting turned down and they had been discussing tactics etc all along and wondering why I never answered questions / spoke crazy unrelated lines / interrupted rudely / gave advice on things that had already been decided & all in all came across as a crazy chick. I even missed the point of the pointed text written questions about it passed over in whispers from the Warlock *blush*

  4. Archi says:

    I’m primarily a PvE player, and this article is pretty accurate. DPS and tanks have issues gearing up, if they are casual players. Heck, I didn’t go on a Kara raid on my main (a mage) until a year after BC was released, and this was due to difficulties in obtaining appropriate gear.

    The issue is getting spell hit, hit rating, defense, and/or expertise, of course. PvP gear just doesn’t have much of them, and actual raiding requires quite a lot (202 spell hit, for instance). On the other hand, using PvP gear works wonderfully for healers. If you’re levelling up a healer alt, check out the BGs! Also, 2H melee DPS requires a much lower amount of hit rating (130ish), so those types of classes can take advantage of the BG epics as well – not to mention that the 2H weapons from PvP actually give you some hit rating.

  5. Lactic Acid says:

    Mmm yeah I find I agree with everything above – still it is so confusing, I get the feeling the real contention is that PVP gear (and badge gear) is considered easier to get then raid gear.

    …Actually I guess I find that in itself hard to understand because I am a casual player and it is hard to get any gear ^_^ in my con’fluffled head it seems that if a raider wants that gear it is just as easy for them to go off and get it so there is no unfairness.

    Which means it could be an issue with having a lack of raiders due to other gear being available?

    It’s certainly a many layered debate 🙂

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